17 replies to this topic

[Magoo]

While browsing the Bring A Trailer auction website I found this interesting 1966 invoice for a Lola T70 Mk II. 

 

3186 British pounds less engine, which works out to around USD 80,000 today. Compared to current costs, that's quite a bargain for a world-class sports racing car. 

 

 

 

 

[Greg Locock]

About double the price of the cheapest Cortina Mk 2 at the time, or half a Jensen FF

[desmo]

Claiming rules are widely underappreciated.

[Greg Locock]

Ha yes, works in karts and r/c planes.

[Joe Bosworth]

At that year I decided to start racing again in the US after several years of Oz racing.  A quick phone call to Fred Opert and a trip to his Upper Saddle NJ shop and I was the owner of a BT15 F3 Brabham Chassis no. 3 complete with a new Hewland gearbox for US$2000.  A subsequent trip to Washington DC and I had a brand new Quicksilver 102 HP FF engine fresh off the break in dyno for $1200.

A couple of 100 more found me with a new set of FF wheels and new tires.

 

All up, less than US$3500 found me on the track with a competitive Formula Ford.

 

Hard to beat that, .

Regards

Edited by Joe Bosworth, 23 December 2022 - 23:37.

[Bob Riebe]

Did some checking and that 3186 pounds in 1966 was worth 8900 U.S. dollars; a genuine Shelby Cobra Coupw owned by a North Dakota gasoline chain owner sold for 9,000 dollars in 1969.

[Magoo]

This was the car in which Don Skogmo was killed at Road America in 1966. A new Armco barrier was installed along pit road for this race, and it turned out to be a hard lesson in barrier design. A veteran driver of high-powered sports cars, he somehow lost control and went sideways into the end of the Armco at the pit road entry. He was killed instantly and the car was disintegrated, though evidently the chassis tag survived. 

Edited by Magoo, 24 December 2022 - 00:13.

[Vitesse2]

About double the price of the cheapest Cortina Mk 2 at the time, or half a Jensen FF

 

 

Did some checking and that 3186 pounds in 1966 was worth 8900 U.S. dollars; a genuine Shelby Cobra Coupw owned by a North Dakota gasoline chain owner sold for 9,000 dollars in 1969.

Bear in mind that it's an export invoice, so wouldn't have included UK Purchase Tax, which for a domestic sale would have added 50% to the basic price. And there would presumably have been import tariffs to pay when it landed in the US as well. Plus any applicable state sales tax(es)? Cost of shipping isn't clear either, but as it's air freight I very much doubt it's included in that price - that was probably arranged and paid for by Mecom and invoiced separately, given that it looks like it had to travel on at least two planes.

 

So the final price would probably have been quite a bit higher ...

[10kDA]

This was the car in which Don Skogmo was killed at Road America in 1966. A new Armco barrier was installed along pit road for this race, and it turned out to be a hard lesson in barrier design. A veteran driver of high-powered sports cars, he somehow lost control and went sideways into the end of the Armco at the pit road entry. He was killed instantly and the car was disintegrated, though evidently the chassis tag survived. 

Recent rains had left wet spots and puddles on the pavement, and Don's car aquaplaned when crossing one of the wet areas. The car went sideways into the endpoint of the Armco and the car burned. His daughter was my Ex's high school BF.

[Greg Locock]

ah, doubletake, best friend. Or she was way ahead of the curve.

[10kDA]

"Best Friend" is the only expanded version of "BF" I know. I was never one of the cool kids.

[BRG]

I suppose a comparison is possible with the price of current replicas.  For instance, the Gardner-Douglas T70 (adapted as a road car) costs some £60k new on the road.  And dare I say it, it is perhaps better built than a 1960s race car.

[mariner]

Just before Covid struck in 2020 I did a benchmarking study for the UK racing club I belong to, 15% of the 400 active racers kindly supplied a lot of data but that didn't answer a frequently  stated view among older members -" racing was so much cheaper in the old days"

 

However one guy had kept his 750F racing records from 1975 and as 750F is still active in largely unchanged form that question could be answered albeit from sample of  one. Basically if you adjust costs from 1975 to 2019 by UK CPI the cost is roughly the same. If you adjust by wage growth its cheaper now. 

 

However there was a very distinct shift in the individual  cost elements. Basically the use of production and heavily controlled engines plus control tyres reduced running  costs by a lot whereas the external costs of licences , entry fees and personal safety gear etc. had skyrocketed.

 

Overall today in UK club racing it seems that "non controllable" racer costs - entry fees, licences safety gear and travel are  40% or so , within limits the race car you choose isn't so critical.

 

Am amusing side revelation was that the biggest capital cost for about1/3rd of racers isn't the race car it is the motorhome!. People with $10,00 cars often tow them behind £30,000 motorhomes. part of the reason is two day meetings plus wanting hte family to come along.

[GreenMachine]

"Best Friend" is the only expanded version of "BF" I know. I was never one of the cool kids.

 

BFF?  To distinguish it from the other, with all its implications ...

[GreenMachine]

Just before Covid struck in 2020 I did a benchmarking study for the UK racing club I belong to, 15% of the 400 active racers kindly supplied a lot of data but that didn't answer a frequently  stated view among older members -" racing was so much cheaper in the old days"

 

However one guy had kept his 750F racing records from 1975 and as 750F is still active in largely unchanged form that question could be answered albeit from sample of  one. Basically if you adjust costs from 1975 to 2019 by UK CPI the cost is roughly the same. If you adjust by wage growth its cheaper now. 

 

However there was a very distinct shift in the individual  cost elements. Basically the use of production and heavily controlled engines plus control tyres reduced running  costs by a lot whereas the external costs of licences , entry fees and personal safety gear etc. had skyrocketed.

 

Overall today in UK club racing it seems that "non controllable" racer costs - entry fees, licences safety gear and travel are  40% or so , within limits the race car you choose isn't so critical.

 

Am amusing side revelation was that the biggest capital cost for about1/3rd of racers isn't the race car it is the motorhome!. People with $10,00 cars often tow them behind £30,000 motorhomes. part of the reason is two day meetings plus wanting hte family to come along.

 

Yes, I see the motorhome becoming more prevalent on a USA site I frequent.  My mind boggles ...

 

Not surprising safety gear is a bigger proportion of costs, considering what safety gear was available, let alone mandated, back in the day.  But that is generally only a one-off, should be amortised over a long period - unless you are in the habit of testing its efficacy.  Helmet, clothing, boots, gloves, underwear, HANS are more of an investment than a running cost.  I am using mostly the same gear I purchased over 10 years ago, it is still servicable and current if not pretty, though I have replaced boots, gloves and balaclava over the last few years as wear has taken a toll.

 

Entry fees are a big item, fuel, brakes and tyres not far behind.  Petrol for the towcar, perhaps one or two night's accomodation for some meetings.  Engine refresh every few years, depending on usage, I've been lucky in that my last couple of refreshes only required bearings and gaskets, no expensive stuff!

 

It is not a sport for the poor people, but careful choice of vehicle and class/events can produce decent bang-for-the-bucks.  OTOH if you have deep pockets, have at it!

[10kDA]

BFF?  To distinguish it from the other, with all its implications ...

Still no clue, still not one of the cool kids, still don't care. I may be wrong but this could be the point where someone is supposed to reply "Nudge-Wink-Say... No... More"

[Magoo]

Just before Covid struck in 2020 I did a benchmarking study for the UK racing club I belong to, 15% of the 400 active racers kindly supplied a lot of data but that didn't answer a frequently  stated view among older members -" racing was so much cheaper in the old days"

 

However one guy had kept his 750F racing records from 1975 and as 750F is still active in largely unchanged form that question could be answered albeit from sample of  one. Basically if you adjust costs from 1975 to 2019 by UK CPI the cost is roughly the same. If you adjust by wage growth its cheaper now. 

 

However there was a very distinct shift in the individual  cost elements. Basically the use of production and heavily controlled engines plus control tyres reduced running  costs by a lot whereas the external costs of licences , entry fees and personal safety gear etc. had skyrocketed.

 

Overall today in UK club racing it seems that "non controllable" racer costs - entry fees, licences safety gear and travel are  40% or so , within limits the race car you choose isn't so critical.

 

Am amusing side revelation was that the biggest capital cost for about1/3rd of racers isn't the race car it is the motorhome!. People with $10,00 cars often tow them behind £30,000 motorhomes. part of the reason is two day meetings plus wanting hte family to come along.

 

 

All great points. 

[Ross Stonefeld]

Still no clue, still not one of the cool kids, still don't care. I may be wrong but this could be the point where someone is supposed to reply "Nudge-Wink-Say... No... More"

 

Boyfriend.