17 replies to this topic

[The Fazz]

What do you think were the greatest ever battles in F1? I am going to start another thread of Great F1 drives to record the brilliant drives by a drive from start to finish.

Please include what you think are the greatest battles / overtaking on this thread... appreciate if you could also describe what made it great in your opinion. Cheers!

A few of mine in no particular order (reciting from memory) -

+ Senna v Schumi, Wendlinger, Hill & Prost (Donington 93)
Started 4th on the grid on a wet track. At the start Schumi got ahead and Senna dropped to 5th, but Senna got back that position at the first corner. Then down the hill, he overtook Wendlinger on the outside(!). Going up the hill, he slid by Damon Hill as if the track was dry. Half-way through the 1st lap (!) he was up with Alain Prost and overtook Prost at the hairpin. Senna went to win the race by a country mile. All this in a car which some people thought was not as good as the Williams Renault of Prost and Hill.

+ Gilles vs Arnoux (Dijon 79)
Gilles in a normally aspirated Ferrari. Arnoux in the turbo Renault. 2 laps from the end of the race, Arnoux is 2nd and Gilles in 3rd after late braking Gilles into the 1st corner. Throughout the lap Gilles keeps as close to Arnoux and stands on the brakes to overtake Arnoux at the 1st corner on the last lap. Gilles car was all over the place after having compromised his racing line... so Arnoux slips by in the next series of bends. Gilles, typically fought back and banged wheels. Both cars almost went off the track, but Arnoux stayed ahead until he sort of slid of a bit. Gilles slipped by, but Arnoux pressured Gilles, and Gilles almost lost it. They raced down the finish straight with Gilles taking 2nd from Arnoux. Brilliant!

I have a few more, but think I should stop typing.

------------------
~@~@~@~@~@~@~@~@~@~@~@~
The Home of The Fazz

[Statesidefan]

Mansell- Senna 1991 Barcelona

Mansell- Senna 1992 Monaco

Mansell- Piquet 1987 Silverstone

Senna- Bellof- Prost 1984 Monaco

Senna- Estoril 1985

------------------
"The strategy of a Formula One race is very simple. It's flat out from the minute the flag drops." Mario Andretti 1976

[Witt]

The only "nostalgic" great pass that springs to mind is that of Mansell on Piquet at GB 87. Everytime i see the pass, no matter how many times i've seen it, sends shivers down my spine. There just seemed to be so much emotion involved.

I think you could add Eddie Irvine pass of Mika Hakkinen & Micheal Schumacher on the outside of the last "ess" bend at suzuka 97 to the list. That pass will be remembered in the future, methinks.

[Don Capps]

Just a few others off the top of my head to consider:

1964 Italian GP/ Monza: Surtees, Gurney
1953 GP d'ACF/ Reims: Hawthorn, Fangio, Ascari
1961 GP d'ACF/ Reims: Baghetti, Gurney, Bonnier
1971 Italian GP/ Monza: Gethin and a gaggle
1967 Italian GP/ Monza: Surtees, Brabham, Clark, Hill
1964 British GP/ Brands Hatch: Clark, G.Hill
1962 Monaco GP/ Monte Carlo: McLaren, P.Hill
1961 Monaco GP/ Monte Carlo: Moss, Ginther
1957 German GP/ Nurburgring: Fangio, Hawthorn, Collins
1956 GP d'ACF/ Reims: Collins, Schell
1935 German GP/ Nurburgring: Nuvolari, von Brauchitisch
1982 Austria/ Osterreichring: de Angelis, Rosberg
1981 Spanish GP/ Jarama: Villeneuve and a gaggle
1933 Monaco GP/ Monte Carlo: Varzi, Nuvolari
1914 GP d'ACF/ Lyons: Lautenschlager, Boillot

...and there are others....of course!

As for descriptions, well, we'll see...that is a LOT of writing and I am already behind in everything.


------------------
Yr fthfl & hmbl srvnt,

Don Capps




[This message has been edited by Don Capps (edited 12-08-1999).]

[SteveB2]

My favorite (somewhat obscure):

Naninni and Berger for third place at Spa in 1990

[John B]

Favorites I can think of (hopefully without repeating any of the previous...)

Mansell/Berger, Mexico 1990. Great Mansell pass in the Peraltada on the next to last lap.

Mansell/Senna, Spain 1986.

Prost/Senna/Schumacher, South Africa 1993.

Tambay/Piquet/Prost/Arnoux, Austria 1983.

Watson/Lauda, from 22nd and 23rd to 1-2, Long Beach 1983. Watson dueled with and passed Lauda as they drove through the field.

Senna/Prost, France 1988

Prost/Marches, France 1990

Piquet/Pironi, Imola 1981



[This message has been edited by John B (edited 12-08-1999).]

[Indian Chief]

Villeneuve's pass of Jones arond the outside at the Tarzan hairpin is very famous, too.
BTW, Witt, where did you get that pass of Mansell on Piquet from Silverstone '87?
Is it available anywhere on the internet? I have been searching it for several months, now.

[J]

Nelson Piquet had a one very memorable one in Hockenheim `82. I can´t recall the driver of that about to be lapped car, but I sure do remember Nelson´s right hook...

J

[This message has been edited by J (edited 12-09-1999).]

[This message has been edited by J (edited 12-09-1999).]

[This message has been edited by J (edited 12-09-1999).]

[DAT]

Indian Chief, it was Eliseo Salazar.

[John B]

Wasn't there a kick involved too?

[Sean]

Jones/Prost - Zanvoort 81

[This message has been edited by Sean (edited 12-09-1999).]

[luisfelipetrigo]

My contribution as a great duel is Peter Revson (PR) and Graham Hill (GH) at Monza 1972.
That year Jackie Stewart was out on the very first lap and could not challange Emerson Fittipaldi who accumulated enough points (with a win) to get the world championship.
PR started 8th and GH 13. They was passing and pressing each other lap after lap; a young and promissing PR and a mature GH were the best show that day. At the end PR was able to hold GH for 4th place.


------------------
Saludos
Luis Felipe

[Ray Bell]

Monaco 1981 - Jones' clever method of putting Piquet out, slicing in with a lap Piquet couldn't match then watching him go mad for a lap and a half until he ran off the road. All very smoothly done.
I know it's not F1, but very close - Tasman Series - Australian GP 1965 (I do talk about this one a lot). On a 4.5-mile public road circuit with three long straights, two timber bridges, a railway level crossing and an underpass. The contenders were Brabham, McLaren and his team mate P. Hill, Clark and G. Hill. All 2.5 Climax powered, with the five of them almost nose to tail for the whole race. P. Hill, Brabham & McLaren held the lap record during the race, all were under the old record, three held the lead at one stage or another, only McLaren and Brabham were never in fifth, and that was the story for the whole distance. Except one must mention the gapes of disbelief when P. Hill overtook Clark on the Long Bridge.
The Long Bridge was entered via a 120mph sweeper and exited the same, heading into a braking area, and that's where Phil did the job on Clark.
There were scuba divers waiting below . . .

[Psychoman]

I, sadly, became an F1 fan just a few years ago, about the start of the F1 Dark Ages. The only passing sequences that I have seen that were any good were Barrichello and Schuey at Magny-Cours just this past June, and Senna and Mansell at Barcelona back in '91 (on tape, of course). The particular moment that stands out for me from the latter is where they're side-by-side, and sparks are flying off the backs of both their cars. Nothing like it, I tell ya...

------------------
"If ignorance is bliss, then knock the smile off my face."
-Zack de la Rocha

[Witt]

IC: I bought the 87 season review, specifically so i could see that pass. Best 40 bucks i ever spent.

Duke have the 87 British GP for sale, and i was about to buy that until i realised it was just 60 minutes of highlights. I thought if it was just highlights, then i may as well pay an extra 10 dollars to see the rest of the races, thus i ended up buying the review.

Keep an eye on the F1 MPEG archive because they have been adding highlights of the 87 season recently. It might pay off to drop them an e-mail, and ask them nicely to add it to the archive.

[Indian Chief]

Good ideae, Witt.
I also e-mail Farzad's F1 gallery and Giles Panton's F1 gallery to try and get that video.

[Leo]

Best F1 overtaking: Alesi retaking the lead from Senna (Phoenix 1990) in an extraordinary bold move, completely surprising the Brazilian.

I'd also like to ad the breathtaking battle between Alesi and Mansell in Suzuka 1994. In fact there was no overtaking at all, but both drivers were never more than a few meters apart. All in extremely wet conditions.

One of the best non-F1 overtaking manoeuvres: Zanardi taking Herta in the Corkscrew at Laguna Seca.